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CineArtist · 2012-02-14 00:04:03

First of all. First post. I am really enjoying 3Dlight and I am testing it now with the free version on Softimage 2012.

I am having difficulty trying to figure out how to smooth the edges of a shadow. Unfortunately since I am new I think it is not letting me upload the image link.

But I have an empty room which is 100 percent enclosed and some small portals for letting light in. Am lighting with the environment only and no lights are in the scene. There is a light pattern on the ground of the interior. First of all I am not sure how it is there. It is as if a light shining in is casting the shadow from the portal. But in similar tests in other renders this is not the case with environment only. But additionally, there are stepped edges to the shadow around this rectangle light pattern. and I can not find any parameters that get rid of it.

I am rendering with high samples in the Image Based Lighting (2048) and an overall Shading Rate of of 2 in the quality panel. Every thing looks smooth into the blacks and no blotching either. I am using Point Based GI and no bleeding (version 3.015).

I have tried higher AA and radius but this does not fix it. Also shadow maps don't seem to be affecting it either as this feature is turned off. And again there is NO light in the scene. So this is not a light shadow quality problem I don't think.

Sorry I can not upload image or screen caps just yet.

Any tips would be helpful in the mean time.

Last edited by CineArtist (2012-02-14 00:06:38)

CineArtist · 2012-02-15 18:37:43

Actually, the shadow (light hole) in question is coming from a sky portal I modeled into the box. Simply forgot it was there.

Any tips on getting rid of this stepped edges around the light pattern?

The only thing I can get to effect it is the Sun Intensity and Scale of the Phsycial Sky env. shader.

But I can not seem to get rid of the steps completely and it seems as if the shadow edge should be soft. I can not seem to get this to happen.

Last edited by CineArtist (2012-02-15 18:43:12)

ActionArt · 2012-02-17 08:30:41

You might want to try posting your example over here. There's a number of people with some experience testing.

http://www.si-community.com/community/v … amp;t=1275

aghiles · 2012-02-17 15:03:32

Can you tell us more about the setup ? Are you using point-based global illumination ?
Can you share the scene so we can check if there is something specific in there?
Thanks,

-- aghiles

CineArtist · 2012-02-17 20:34:10

All that info is in my first post.

But with 3.1 currently I set the Bleed to "none" which seems to give the same effect.

Here is the scene:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/15928817/3Delig … DLight.scn

CineArtist · 2012-02-17 20:37:06

ActionArt wrote:
You might want to try posting your example over here. There's a number of people with some experience testing.

http://www.si-community.com/community/v … amp;t=1275

Great. Aware of this site. Thanks. Maybe I'll post there if I can't get it sorted here.

victor · 2012-03-21 12:05:06

Actually it is not good idea to use IBL without GI. I think the best solution is using Point-Based Global Illumination with "window lights". As "window lights" I used a grid that scaled to window size, with constant material and excluded from primary visibility:

CineArtist · 2012-04-20 04:05:47

That gives a look I am not really interested in. I have tried it of course already. But thank you for taking the time.

3Delight perhaps is wired differently. But really there is no reason why this should not work. The same set up works in Mental Ray without GI and It also works in a similar way in LightWave. Although in LightWave it is brute for GI which gives another look, but still has the definition that is needed as well as the blacks.

I am interested seeing that the maximum flexibility is restored to 3Dlight rather than cornering an artist into using the tool in a way to avoid artifacts that should not be there in the first place.

The scene set up was exactly the look I was trying for exactly with the set up I wanted for reasons not necessary to go into here.

My scene proves that this is broken and that it should be fixed so that it works.

N ow we can go on about workflow in 3Dlight all we want. But if that workflow corners me into a method that does not give me the look I and set up I was looking for then, why am I interested in 3Delight?

It works in other solutions. It is a setting here. And it should work. Plain and simple.

3Delight has a great look. The same settings work in an out door scene very well. But placed inside the calculations seem to break down and show artifacts. (many many more bounces to calculate).

However these calcs do not beak down in MR, LightWave or Vray in pretty much the same set up.

Looks to me like a flaw in the code someplace.

Last edited by CineArtist (2012-04-20 04:13:49)

cleger · 2012-04-20 08:51:50

CineArtist, it's hard to help you with the way that you are acting.

I'm just trying to say that maybe as an artist and end user, you should not be blaming everything on faulty coding (which may or may not be the case).

You talk about being cornered into these "workflows" but it sounds like you have cornered yourself into a very specific workflow that you expect to work the same across different renderers. MR, LightWave, Vray, 3Delight, etc are each a different renderer. Expecting these very different things to do the same things with all the same one click settings is not an appropriate attitude.

Unfortunately, I can't open your file because I do not have Softimage. However, I'm still not clear as to what you're trying to achieve (other than you saying you don't want the stepped shadows). Can you post images of the renders you are getting from MR or LightWave, the ones that you are trying to look more like?

You didn't really answer aghiles' questions, because the answers are not in your first post as you said they were.

Why are you using a Shading Rate of 2? You mentioned a Physical Sky env. shader, which I do not have a lot of experience using. However, I do remember reading in the manual that one of the IBL functions will create a light to cast shadows using the brighter parts of the image. You might be seeing something to that effect.

Other than not having more information (and without being able to dive into the scene), I'm afraid that's all I have to say.

Last edited by cleger (2012-04-20 10:22:30)

aghiles · 2012-04-20 16:06:45

CineArtist, we hear you. We are looking at this problem and at the GI options in general. Please give us some time.
-- aghiles

CineArtist · 2012-04-20 23:17:49

Thanks aghiles. As I said, I really do like the way 3Dlelght looks. I'll keep an eye here for some kind of solution. I was digging it all the way up to the point I found these artifacts.

@ cldeger. I understand where you are coming from and how it would seem that way to you. No worries.

Ninjapowa · 2012-05-15 13:21:54

Hello!
Victor, in your example above you say that you placed a grid in the window with a constant material, then turned on IBL with Global Illumination right?
If so, what I tried was to use only a grid like that but without any lights to see only that effect but I get black renders...??
My render settings are :
IBL enabled
GI is set to Point-Based, with a quality of 3 and the Photon Mapping render set to always with write enabled.

Also, second question, again in your pic above the sky is blue, is that from a texture? I usually use a gradient plugged into the environment texture node in MR so I can control the color grade effect of my sky, but in 3DLight I get an error converting this.

thanks!

PS - so sorry to hijack the thread... :(

victor · 2012-05-16 14:52:56

Hello Ninjapowa,

1) Could you please provide the scene, I will check and explain what's wrong.
2) Sky on picture above is "Physical Sky (mia)". Please provide the error scene.

Last edited by victor (2012-05-16 14:55:33)

Ninjapowa · 2012-05-17 06:28:05

Hello Victor!
I got it to work finally, however I would still appreciate if you can take a look at this test scene to see which settings would be needed to give me smooth FG results.
http://netvg.visionglobale.com/dl.php?91-qSZ5z1

In this scene, if you disable IBL, you'll only get the grids effect (constant) in the room, but I'm getting "splotches", and if I understand correctly, I really should only be playing around with the Point cloud settings?

thanks so much for your time!

CineArtist · 2012-10-23 11:27:23

aghiles wrote:
CineArtist, we hear you. We are looking at this problem and at the GI options in general. Please give us some time.
-- aghiles

So how is it going? I still like 3Delight quite a bit. I am interested in knowing if you have addressed any of these issues I have raised some months ago.

Forums

#1 2012-02-14 00:04:03

Shadow Question

#2 2012-02-15 18:37:43

Re: Shadow Question

#3 2012-02-17 08:30:41

Re: Shadow Question

#4 2012-02-17 15:03:32

Re: Shadow Question

#5 2012-02-17 20:34:10

Re: Shadow Question

#6 2012-02-17 20:37:06

Re: Shadow Question

ActionArt wrote:

#7 2012-03-21 12:05:06

Re: Shadow Question

#8 2012-04-20 04:05:47

Re: Shadow Question

#9 2012-04-20 08:51:50

Re: Shadow Question

#10 2012-04-20 16:06:45

Re: Shadow Question

#11 2012-04-20 23:17:49

Re: Shadow Question

#12 2012-05-15 13:21:54

Re: Shadow Question

#13 2012-05-16 14:52:56

Re: Shadow Question

#14 2012-05-17 06:28:05

Re: Shadow Question

#15 2012-10-23 11:27:23

Re: Shadow Question

aghiles wrote:

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